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Hi! Trying to figure out several things. First - I got my 67 Firebird without air cleaner (at the beginning I thought that it simply removed but keep reading). It has Performer RPM intake on what it seems to be a stock 400 and it came with Edelbrock 1406 carb. Hood is the "regular" no scoops or anything. Aparently due to this Performer RPM manifold the carb sits about 1 and 1/2 inch higher and as a consequence the original air cleaner does not fit, I tried to go with original Single or Dual Snorkel low drop air cleaner.Then I found pics from eBay sold listings with even deeper low drop air cleaner but the seller did not knew what it came from and did not identify it, just said its likely from GTO. Here is a picture from that sold listing - it seems lower drop than the stock low drop cleaner, can anyone tell me what air cleaner is that? It seems to me that this should fit since it has deeper "bulge".

s1430b.jpg
s1430a.jpg


Okay. This is not the whole story. The carb - Edelbrock 1406, took it apart, dipped it in Berryman, washed cleaned - still no idle (I already had fuel tank removed, washed out, hoses blowed, etc) Went through the carb a second time - still found some more grime washed out and then noticed that shafts are pretty worn out, especially on the opposite side of throttle linkage. So naturally it should be the source of vacuum leaks. I know I should just get a better carb but I wanted to get this one up and running with minimal investments because I have not yet decided if I should stick with Edelbrock at all. So I used some rubber orings to seal the shafts and that helped alot (had some old bottom orings from BMW 3-series injectors and those fit nice with some minimal alteration, see pic).



So after taking carb apart 3 times and fiddling with it I finally got it idle more or less decently. Since this all is new to me the old carbs and 67 Pontiac in particular I was doing some a research and reading about carbs and found many people recommending to throw Edelbrock in trash and get Rochester QuadraJet for Pontiac 400, a bit more tricky to calibrate but everyone loves those huge secondaries. Though just by looking at the pics of QuadraJet (have not got my hands on one yet) I can see that it is taller than Edelbrock 1406 what means even less clearance for the air cleaner. So is it taller or not? I have not seen heigh measurements anywhere or maybe I dont know how to google..

Currently I have a temporary mockup air filter from some Cherokee parts (see pic) while I am looking for an air cleaner that fits and also making decision on what carb should I go with. So, the questions that I need answer for:

  • should I switch to Rochested QuadraJet?
  • is Rochester QuadraJet taller than Edelbrock 1406?
  • is there an air filter that fits with either of there carbs on top of Performer RPM if I have the "normal" hood?



Thanks,

Neal
 

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"... should I switch to Rochested QuadraJet?..."

YES ! IMO :yes

"...is there an air filter that fits with either of there carbs on top of Performer RPM if I have the "normal" hood?..."

There are lots of low profile air cleaners. Summit lists the distance above the carb flange, on many of the air cleaner assemblies they sell.

http://www.summitracing.com/search/department/air-fuel-delivery/section/air-cleaners-flame-arrestors-scoops/part-type/air-cleaners/air-cleaner-fitment/single-4-barrel-5-1-8-in-diameter/base-style/dropped/air-cleaner-shape/round/air-cleaner-size/14-in-diameter?N=4294951509%2B4294949633%2B4294949532%2B4294949533%2B4294949554%2B4294949604%2B4294949603&SortBy=Default&SortOrder=Ascending

But I don't know how low you can go and still clear the carb, all the throttle linkage, plumbing, etc. I think I read that you can go a little lower with some Q-jets, than with the E-cabs. But, I don't know EXACTLY what combo will work best.

The easiest way might be to just switch to a Performer #2156 intake. They are available used, for about $150 or maybe a little less locally, and will work with either square or spread bore carbs. :yes

Or you can go with a factory iron intake and a Q-jet. :smile22:
 

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Here is mine , think its a plain performer with 600 cfm edelbrock, that air filter is sittin on a tall spacer to clear the fuel line that comes straight out of the Carb and still clears the hood

3" tall air cleaner
 

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I don't know the answer to your question since I'm using a stock iron intake. But I'd love to buy that dual snorkel air cleaner if you decide not to use it!

:D
 

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Wait wait, that dual snorkel air cleaner is the one I would like to get - not the one I have - I dont have any (except that temporary DIY mockup that looks like from riceboy honda), the car came without air cleaner. I was able to get the standard dual snorkel and that is so massive that it bags the hood so I returned it - because its also wide not just tall. Yes the the space between carb and in the middle is good 3 inches I measured that but that could possibly accept only round aftermarket filters that I dont want to use - I want one with either single or dual snorkels because that way it will suck less hot air! The round ones are ok for cold climates not here in CA where temps under hood can get crazy.

So that pictured dual snorkel should fit because i can see it should sit lower than those regular dual snorkels you see around because it has visibly deeper raise. I need to know what car it came off originally so I know what to look for. Basically I need to identify what is it. Seems like shaker but it has that top cover that is not like shaker.. I am puzzled here.

I would like to keep Performer RPM as people say this is probably the best flowing manifold. The tricky part is to solve the manifold + carb + dual snorkel air cleaner + stock hood equation in the way that it all fits!
 

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"... should I switch to Rochested QuadraJet?..."

YES ! IMO :yes

There are lots of low profile air cleaners. Summit lists the distance above the carb flange, on many of the air cleaner assemblies they sell.

http://www.summitracing.com/search/department/air-fuel-delivery/section/air-cleaners-flame-arrestors-scoops/part-type/air-cleaners/air-cleaner-fitment/single-4-barrel-5-1-8-in-diameter/base-style/dropped/air-cleaner-shape/round/air-cleaner-size/14-in-diameter?N=4294951509%2B4294949633%2B4294949532%2B4294949533%2B4294949554%2B4294949604%2B4294949603&SortBy=Default&SortOrder=Ascending

But I don't know how low you can go and still clear the carb, all the throttle linkage, plumbing, etc. I think I read that you can go a little lower with some Q-jets, than with the E-cabs. But, I don't know EXACTLY what combo will work best.

The easiest way might be to just switch to a Performer #2156 intake. They are available used, for about $150 or maybe a little less locally, and will work with either square or spread bore carbs. :yes

Or you can go with a factory iron intake and a Q-jet. :smile22:
I would like to keep RPM intake, for what I have read it should be one of if not the best intake manifold.

I was not clear about air cleaners - I would prefer the stock one or stock look-a-like one. Dual snorkel would be the best if I can find the lowest possible rise which I think I have found by googling up that pic in my first post I just need your help to identify from what car it came of - make, model, year - it is most likely from some Pontiac but which one and what year? If i knew that I would know what to look for! I feel that this cleaner will fit:

s1430b.jpg


The Rochester QuadraJet - yes I want one and I need one because the current Edelbrock is just too worn - in the pic it is all shiny etc but thats deceiving, I simply cleaned it to perfecion but actaully it looked like crap. Only then I realized that it is too worn and people on the web ar saying that Edelbrock suffers from shaft wearing unlike other carbs where shafts have seats pressed in, Edelbrock just drills a hole in aluminum and thats it - such carb is not a long runner. No it will run only it will start idling like crap after some time like several years of intense use and also depending how strong is your throttle linkage spring and how bad is its angle because all this is handled by that primary shaft...
 

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"...It has Performer RPM intake on what it seems to be a stock 400..."

If the 400 is "stock", and you intend to keep it fairly stock, the 2156 Performer will probably give you better low end power than the RPM. Now if you plan to go with a big bad 455 +, then the RPM might help. Otherwise the 2156 will be better in the rpm range you'll be running on the street. :yes

Looks to me like it would solve all your problems. More low end performance and you can use any carb, and most any air cleaner. I can't see how you could lose.

"...I just need your help to identify from what car it came of - make, model, year - it is most likely from some Pontiac but which one and what year? If i knew that I would know what to look for!..."

I'm not sure exactly how many models used a dual snorkel. But I know that the 455HO engines used 'em in the '71 & '72 A-bodies, and probably some of the non-TA Birds which had the 455HO. Some of the early '70's 400 and D-port 455's probably also used 'em. May have come on lots of non-ram air Birds, A-bodies, and GP's.

Here's some on Ebay. But they ain't cheap. :no

http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=p2053587.m570.l1313.TR0.TRC0.H0.Xpontiac+dual+snorkel+air+cleaner.TRS0&_nkw=pontiac+dual+snorkel+air+cleaner&_sacat=0

Summit also sells the Goodmark repro, which is said to fit '69-'72 A-bodies.

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/gmk-4332230695s/overview/make/pontiac

http://autoplicity.com/2130354-goodmark?gclid=CjwKEAjwq6m3BRCP7IfMq6Oo9gESJACRc0bNSB8BxprhyAfsptzQQSOjq2BwI1oW8JiuXqEe-VrSkhoC9T3w_wcB

I think the one in this 1st pic came on a non-Ram Air '70 Formula.
 

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Edelbrock carbs are uber simple. Not sure what the issue your having. They have no metering rods, only idle mixture screws and a couple floats. Sound like theres more to this carb than meets the eye. I agree with Don, on a stock 400, the std edelbrock intake is the way to go and should solve all of your issues and give you the opportunity to run a Qjet and that snorkle air cleaner.
 
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