[first gen bird]

Have a 67 firebird with a 400 4 speed. timing chain stretched and jumped a tooth. Mileage unknown so while its down decided to freshen things up. Has a 1975 400 block with #16 heads. need advice on part brands, anything i need to pay special attn to, etc. Haven't worked on a pontiac in 20 years. thanks for any help or advice. Just a weekend driver not a race car but still want respectable power.

 

[72 blackbird]

A Pontiac V-8 typically costs more to complete rebuild vs. your typical SBC, but overall that cost is depends on factors like how much machine shops charge in your area, and how much you budget for replacement parts (pistons, rods, bearings, cam etc.). I've been rebuilding Pontiacs for about 22 years and the internals that typically cause a performance street engine to fail are the cast rods and spun-welded 2-piece valves- both are relatively cheap upgrades compared to the cost of a whole build. You can buy 5140 forged I-beams for about $250/set from most Pontiac parts vendors- they're also most likely to stock good quality forged stainless 1-piece valves ($150/set) as well. Forged pistons start at around $360/set (Sealed Power), but for a bit more you can get Icons or Probes ($445-455/set), which are lighter and bushed for floating pins.

Geno

 

[first gen bird]

A Pontiac V-8 typically costs more to complete rebuild vs. your typical SBC, but overall that cost is depends on factors like how much machine shops charge in your area, and how much you budget for replacement parts (pistons, rods, bearings, cam etc.). I've been rebuilding Pontiacs for about 22 years and the internals that typically cause a performance street engine to fail are the cast rods and spun-welded 2-piece valves- both are relatively cheap upgrades compared to the cost of a whole build. You can buy 5140 forged I-beams for about $250/set from most Pontiac parts vendors- they're also most likely to stock good quality forged stainless 1-piece valves ($150/set) as well. Forged pistons start at around $360/set (Sealed Power), but for a bit more you can get Icons or Probes ($445-455/set), which are lighter and bushed for floating pins.

Geno

 

[first gen bird]

thanks Geno: I've had differing opinions on oil pumps. high volume vs high pressure. Any thoughts. Also if cylinders are good is it possible to just hone and rering. What brand of bearings would you recommend. Thanks

 

[72 blackbird]

thanks Geno: I've had differing opinions on oil pumps. high volume vs high pressure. Any thoughts. Also if cylinders are good is it possible to just hone and rering. What brand of bearings would you recommend. Thanks

Hi Robert,
Pontac V-8's use a high pressure oil pump standard- the Melling M-54D-S is what is usually sold as a standard replacement oil pump at most auto parts stores. It puts out around 50-60 psi, and with good oil clearances will keep your journals well-oiled and healthy. Good side rod clearances will also ensure good oil pressure at all operating ranges. I prefer King AM bearings, which are a bit more expensive but seem to have good wear characteristics.

A machinist can check your cylinder bores- any taper (difference in diameter at the top of the bore vs. the bottom) over .001" will require at least a power hone to eliminate this worn condition. But I have seen engines w/ as much as .005 taper that still ran well and made decent compression.

Geno

 

[first gen bird]

thanks again Geno for the info. Want to get this right the first time. Can you recommend a cam. Have performer intake and full length headers. Currently have a junk 600 holly that has to go. Carb size is also something i'm seeing a big difference on. Have always prefered Edelbrock carbs on my sbc in the past but keep seeing q-jets listed? Need good vacuum for power brakes. Thanks

 

[72 blackbird]

Cam choice is very subjective and depends on how you like your engine to idle (smooth as glass, lopey, chopy, or somewhere in between)- talk to your builder and he can suggest some grinds for you. If you need good vacuum for power brakes I recommend you stay w/ a cam that has a 112-114 LSA (lope separation angle), as these tend to idle smoother and have more vacuum, despite having wider duration and more lift than stock. Your 400 w/ no.16 heads has a small combustion chamber (72cc) and makes 10:1 SCR- a cam w/ an advertised duration of around 280-290 degrees will take advantage of this higher compression.

And as far as carbs are concerned, I've run Holleys for most of the 30+ years I've been into Firebirds and T/A's- if you have a bad Holley that's nor running well, it's most likely due to poor carb choice, needs a rebuild, or lack of knowledge on the rebuilder. A single feed 600 cfm 4-bbl. Holley is a poor choice for a 400- a dual-feed 750 cfm vacuum secondary will make a better all-around carb and can be tuned to deliver reasonable fuel economy as well. Holleys and Holley-type carbs are used in professional racing because they work- a good carb and ignition tune will also prove it to be an excellent performance carb. Q-Jets are also good carbs, but must be properly rebuilt to function well and offer huge secondaries which deliver great performance as well. The E-carbs are decent as far as bolt-on performers go, but their side-mounted fuel bowls will limit performance.

Geno

 

[first gen bird]

Cam choice is very subjective and depends on how you like your engine to idle (smooth as glass, lopey, chopy, or somewhere in between)- talk to your builder and he can suggest some grinds for you. If you need good vacuum for power brakes I recommend you stay w/ a cam that has a 112-114 LSA (lope separation angle), as these tend to idle smoother and have more vacuum, despite having wider duration and more lift than stock. Your 400 w/ no.16 heads has a small combustion chamber (72cc) and makes 10:1 SCR- a cam w/ an advertised duration of around 280-290 degrees will take advantage of this higher compression.

And as far as carbs are concerned, I've run Holleys for most of the 30+ years I've been into Firebirds and T/A's- if you have a bad Holley that's nor running well, it's most likely due to poor carb choice, needs a rebuild, or lack of knowledge on the rebuilder. A single feed 600 cfm 4-bbl. Holley is a poor choice for a 400- a dual-feed 750 cfm vacuum secondary will make a better all-around carb and can be tuned to deliver reasonable fuel economy as well. Holleys and Holley-type carbs are used in professional racing because they work- a good carb and ignition tune will also prove it to be an excellent performance carb. Q-Jets are also good carbs, but must be properly rebuilt to function well and offer huge secondaries which deliver great performance as well. The E-carbs are decent as far as bolt-on performers go, but their side-mounted fuel bowls will limit performance.

Geno

 

[first gen bird]

Thanks for the help. Everything you brought up makes perfect sense. Guess i've been away to long(children) you pointed me in the right direction. Appreciate the advice. Need to get a picture of my Bird up and i"ll let you know how she runs when i get done. Richard

 

[cwi inspector]

Hi Richard. Good to see someone else on here from the St.Louis area. I live in Maryville, IL. just across the river. If you get your Bird running or not, you should come the Worlds Largest catsup bottle festival in Collinsville on July 10th from 10:00 a.m. to 5:00 p.m. I went last year and there was easily 200 cars there. Heres the link to the Lakers car club schedule of area events. You can see the flyer on there.

 

[76ta]

hey NORTHERN AUTO PARTS is pretty good on price and brands a hole rebuild kit is only $600 for a 400 pontiac .

 

[72 blackbird]

I've found piecing a rebuild kit together to be more economical, and I get better parts than any generic kit would offer (since the point of those kits is to give you the illusion of getting a value by buying everything in one package). I buy the pistons and rods separately so I get the best quality parts for the money- don't bother w/ even resizing the rods since they're cast. I get those from Pacific Performance racing, since they have some of the best prices on forged rods and pistons. I also get my bearings from PPR since their prices on those are very good. Summit sells a full gasket set for $65- can't beat that for a premium quality gasket set.

I don't always do a full rebuild on every engine I have- I recently picked up a running 350P for $50- I'm going through that engine to just reseal and clean it up. In addition to a graphite rear main seal, I'll put ARP rod bolts and a new cam in it- not the usual when I rebuild an engine, but this will be only a cruiser engine to get my Bird running until my 455 is done (hopefully this summer).

Geno