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Idle & Acceleration Rough


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#21 ShredDead

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Posted 12 November 2005 - 10:47 AM

Well I purchased a new air filter and TPS this morning made by "GP Sorensen" and installed it. Whoa!!!! what happened? The idle is now at 2200 rpm's. I took the new TPS off and looked to see if there was any difference between the original and this one. There is. The spring controlled lever is slightly higher back than the original. When lining up the lever with the TPS drive lever it actually tells the ECM that I have my foot on the gas. I even tried repositioning it and I still got the same problem.

I reinstalled the original TPS back to its discolored position on the throttle body and now this one is freakin' out as well. It can't be that difficult lining this up. So I drove the car to AutoZone and had them pull the codes. -- Code 22 --

Code 22 -- Sticking or misadjusted TPS; poor electrical connection, open or short in circuit; defective TPS; defective ECM

I drove the car back home, disconnected the negative side of the battery and loosened the original TPS from the throttle body to reposition the levers again. Reconnected everything and now the car idles at 800 rpm's. Took the car for a short spin and came back home and now the car idles at 1100 rpm's.

Completely baffled.

#22 FBN Firebird Nation

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Posted 12 November 2005 - 11:35 AM

It could be the ECM, so maybe you should start to look at that next. I wish I could tell you how to test it, but I don't know much about the 3rd gen. Usually the 3rd and 4th gens are fairly similiar, so let me look into this a little more and see what I can come up with.

#23 ShredDead

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Posted 16 November 2005 - 03:41 PM

Well readers I took the car to the dealer Monday evening after work to see if they could tell me anything or do something to the car. They adjusted my TPS and said that my fuel pressure was reading at around 67 psi, so this too was adjusted to 45 psi. The service manager also pointed out that I had a bad plug wire so I told him that I would take care of this when I got home.

At home I replaced all the plug wires and guess what? The car started but only ran long enough for me to make it up the street and back before it completely died. The car wouldn't start again. In fact, I couldn't hear the fuel pump kick on anymore. Now I never had this problem before until I took it to the shop.

Tuesday morning at 7am I knew the car had to go back so this time I did hear the fuel pump kick on and the car started. I got it to the shop, which is only 2 blocks away, and the car died inside the service garage.

** Wilson County Pontiac GMC in Lebanon, TN **
They said at $1450.00 that I have a bad fuel pump, regulator, and fuel rails . I told them that was B.S. that the car was running before I brought it to them and all I had done when I left last night was change the plug wires, one at a time. An hour later, GMC tells me that they don't think that it's the above mentioned problem that they believe it's my ECM. I told them that this diagnoses could be correct for them to make the repair. Now they had to order the part and the car wouldn't be ready until later on. I get a call at 4pm telling me that there's a problem. GMC says, "The ECM in my car isn't the correct one and by putting the correct one in that it will cause other problems." How is this so? Even if my ECM was incorrect I never had a problem. So I asked if they at least got the car running and they responded with a yes. So I go up to get the car and this is what GMC tells me, "We don't know what the problem is but in your best interest you should take the car to somebody who can work on older cars." I took my keys, didn't have to pay a dime, and I wasn't about to either and left. Started the car up, pulled off the lot, drove about 50 feet, and BAM it died.

So now I'm left with a dead car that had to be towed to another service station. You talk about a bunch of S**T!!

#24 FBN Firebird Nation

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Posted 16 November 2005 - 05:47 PM

Wow, what a horror story that is. Sorry to hear about all this.

#25 FAST RS

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Posted 17 November 2005 - 12:38 PM

Second article down.

http://www.thirdgen....h/tpimod2.shtml
1968 Pontiac Firebird
455 bored .30 over with TRW forged pistons, Torker 2 intake, 750 cfm Demon Carb, ISKE Cam, Mallory HyFire ignition box with a Mallory unilight distributor Super Comp Headers, 3 inch cutouts, 3 inch exhaust into Flowmaster 40 series mufflers. Almunium Drive Shaft, All new suspension Eaton Springs out back Moog up front with KYB gas Adjusts all around.


1991 Camaro RS V-6
MODS: FAST CHIP STAGE 2
MSD 6 AL, MSD COIL
CAI, Underdrive pullys.
And some stuff i cant think of at the moment.

#26 FAST RS

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Posted 17 November 2005 - 12:40 PM

You can get a new ECM from autzone for 100 dollars. and get the chip you need from a bone yard.
1968 Pontiac Firebird
455 bored .30 over with TRW forged pistons, Torker 2 intake, 750 cfm Demon Carb, ISKE Cam, Mallory HyFire ignition box with a Mallory unilight distributor Super Comp Headers, 3 inch cutouts, 3 inch exhaust into Flowmaster 40 series mufflers. Almunium Drive Shaft, All new suspension Eaton Springs out back Moog up front with KYB gas Adjusts all around.


1991 Camaro RS V-6
MODS: FAST CHIP STAGE 2
MSD 6 AL, MSD COIL
CAI, Underdrive pullys.
And some stuff i cant think of at the moment.

#27 ShredDead

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  • Model: Firebird
  • Engine: V6 2.8L MPFI
  • Transmission: Borg-Warner T5 5-speed

Posted 17 November 2005 - 03:29 PM

Those members who have been keeping up with this topic know that I had the car towed to another service station. Today I called them and was told some good news. They fixed the problem.

Drum Roll Please ................................

The EST (Electronic Spark Timing) for the distributor.

General Discription:
1. To provide improved engine performance, fuel economy and control of exhaust emissions, the ECM controls distributor spark advance (ignition timing) with the EST system.
2. The ECM receives a reference pulse from the distributor, which indicates both engine rpm and crankshaft position. The ECM then determines the proper spark advance for the engine operating conditions and sends an EST pulse to the distributor.

Check:
3. The ECM will set EST at a specified value when the diagnostic terminal in the ALDL connector is grounded. To check for EST operation, the timing should be checked at 2000 rpm's with the terminal ungrounded. Then ground the diagnostic terminal. If the timing changes at 2000 rpm, the EST is operating. A fault in the EST system will usually set Trouble Code 42.


The service guy actually laughed about GMC not being able to detect and fix this. He also said that this is a known problem in GMC and Ford. Just goes to show me, and hopefully others, that just because you take your car to the dealer that they know what the hell their doing. To them, it's about you not being knowlegable and the opportunity for them to rip you off. Good thing I did take their advice and go somewhere where they can work on cars for now she purrs like a kitten.

#28

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Posted 27 December 2008 - 10:39 AM

Those members who have been keeping up with this topic know that I had the car towed to another service station. Today I called them and was told some good news. They fixed the problem.

Drum Roll Please ................................

The EST (Electronic Spark Timing) for the distributor.

General Discription:
1. To provide improved engine performance, fuel economy and control of exhaust emissions, the ECM controls distributor spark advance (ignition timing) with the EST system.
2. The ECM receives a reference pulse from the distributor, which indicates both engine rpm and crankshaft position. The ECM then determines the proper spark advance for the engine operating conditions and sends an EST pulse to the distributor.

Check:
3. The ECM will set EST at a specified value when the diagnostic terminal in the ALDL connector is grounded. To check for EST operation, the timing should be checked at 2000 rpm's with the terminal ungrounded. Then ground the diagnostic terminal. If the timing changes at 2000 rpm, the EST is operating. A fault in the EST system will usually set Trouble Code 42.


The service guy actually laughed about GMC not being able to detect and fix this. He also said that this is a known problem in GMC and Ford. Just goes to show me, and hopefully others, that just because you take your car to the dealer that they know what the hell their doing. To them, it's about you not being knowlegable and the opportunity for them to rip you off. Good thing I did take their advice and go somewhere where they can work on cars for now she purrs like a kitten.



#29

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Posted 27 December 2008 - 10:45 AM

thanks ,wish i had checked here before replacing $60 fuel filter
$160 for plugs and wires.. with no results.

002 blkbird

#30 FBN Firebird Nation

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Posted 27 December 2008 - 10:55 AM

thanks ,wish i had checked here before replacing $60 fuel filter
$160 for plugs and wires.. with no results.

002 blkbird


Welcome to FBN Michael, did you get your problem sorted out?




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